Out of position players

my entire defense is pretty much OOP and I use tackles at guard. they play like their base stats regardless of what the overall reflects.

I used to post on reddit(before it died), like the best 3 or so pass rushers at each position and they have power or finesse to help decide which lineman to put where.

Tpbv9 said:

Here’s the video he used offensive lineman https://youtu.be/ng8myb0_iUo?si=knYMmz8O6olSOiGX

Thanks for the link. I watched the full video, didn't see anywhere that he mentions the fact there's a minus 10 Awareness penalty for OOP, he showed us a few practice mode plays and suggested some conspiracy theory, which he even admits is based on his own perception or "feelings" but not sure I'm convinced. 

Honestly, I think Zan is a moron, I'm not inclined to blindly trust his gut feelings. And he's using blockers who are all within the same blocking thresholds, meaning 85+ -- for me, personally, I'll continue using the 85+ Tackles OOP as Guards, rather than say an 80 range for most important blocking stats (which in my mind I'm basically only looking at PBP, PBF & RBK) as most stats are essentially meaningless. 

I think we can comfortably suggest that blocking is wildly inconsistent, which is in line with basically every other aspect of the game. Thank you for the link, as well as for making me consider some aspects of the game I might have otherwise overlooked.

peatrick said:

Thanks for the link. I watched the full video, didn't see anywhere that he mentions the fact there's a minus 10 Awareness penalty for OOP, he showed us a few practice mode plays and suggested some conspiracy theory, which he even admits is based on his own perception or "feelings" but not sure I'm convinced. 

Honestly, I think Zan is a moron, I'm not inclined to blindly trust his gut feelings. And he's using blockers who are all within the same blocking thresholds, meaning 85+ -- for me, personally, I'll continue using the 85+ Tackles OOP as Guards, rather than say an 80 range for most important blocking stats (which in my mind I'm basically only looking at PBP, PBF & RBK) as most stats are essentially meaningless. 

I think we can comfortably suggest that blocking is wildly inconsistent, which is in line with basically every other aspect of the game. Thank you for the link, as well as for making me consider some aspects of the game I might have otherwise overlooked.

Well if it doesn’t affect ratings how else do you think the game comes to conclusion to lower a cards overall? There’s something that turns an 88 into an 84 we just don’t fully understand what it is I think. The -10 awareness was in all past Maddens for oop. I’m assuming it’s still in the game.

Tpbv9 said:

Well if it doesn’t affect ratings how else do you think the game comes to conclusion to lower a cards overall? There’s something that turns an 88 into an 84 we just don’t fully understand what it is I think. The -10 awareness was in all past Maddens for oop. I’m assuming it’s still in the game.

What you are saying directly contradicts Zan's info that you shared.  He's saying THIS YEAR. . . (discussing specific changes to OOP players), i'll do my best to quote Zan here,

Doing something that we have done for years, now is actually hurting us... and that is, out of position players.

In prior years, we've all been running cards out of position, on both sides of the ball.  The rating is meaningless, i don't care if they make those values 5 OVR.  It has exactly zero impact on gameplay situations.  Lots of assumptions are being made here, from us all -- because EA doesn't understand their product, so waiting or hoping for them to communicate basic gameplay changes will be a lesson in futility.

My advice to you would be to ignore OVR ratings.  Stats barely matter, the game has been entirely ability driven for years.  Perhaps that will change with the reduction in AP, but doubtful.  In its current state the gameplay just feels broken.  Zones don't react well in coverage, especially deep blues.

Upon closer inspection, i'm going to assume you plucked your information from this comment, correct?

@SG-4u (2 days ago)
For at least the last decade the only penalty for an out of position player is their awareness is lowered (10 points if I remember correctly). Back then awareness meant almost nothing. It is used much more now. Knowing Madden, I suspect awareness is still the only penalty. Would be nice if someone could put together a master document on what all of the ratings do and what all of the thresholds are. Don’t expect EA to do the decent thing and tell it’s customers how the product works. We have to get info from mutleaks and such.

I have no idea what is or is not true, but i'm chalking this up to the ridiculously inconsistent and buggy ass gameplay.  You can run 10 plays with identical players and get wildly different results, in blocking, in route running, in pass coverage... across the board.  Doubt we'll get any actual data to inform our decision-making, which is unfortunate.  MUTLeaks out there doing the lord's wr0k, blessing us with actual patch changes, some code snippets even, but not much beyond that.

peatrick said:

What you are saying directly contradicts Zan's info that you shared.  He's saying THIS YEAR. . . (discussing specific changes to OOP players), i'll do my best to quote Zan here,

Doing something that we have done for years, now is actually hurting us... and that is, out of position players.

In prior years, we've all been running cards out of position, on both sides of the ball.  The rating is meaningless, i don't care if they make those values 5 OVR.  It has exactly zero impact on gameplay situations.  Lots of assumptions are being made here, from us all -- because EA doesn't understand their product, so waiting or hoping for them to communicate basic gameplay changes will be a lesson in futility.

My advice to you would be to ignore OVR ratings.  Stats barely matter, the game has been entirely ability driven for years.  Perhaps that will change with the reduction in AP, but doubtful.  In its current state the gameplay just feels broken.  Zones don't react well in coverage, especially deep blues.

Upon closer inspection, i'm going to assume you plucked your information from this comment, correct?

@SG-4u (2 days ago)
For at least the last decade the only penalty for an out of position player is their awareness is lowered (10 points if I remember correctly). Back then awareness meant almost nothing. It is used much more now. Knowing Madden, I suspect awareness is still the only penalty. Would be nice if someone could put together a master document on what all of the ratings do and what all of the thresholds are. Don’t expect EA to do the decent thing and tell it’s customers how the product works. We have to get info from mutleaks and such.

I have no idea what is or is not true, but i'm chalking this up to the ridiculously inconsistent and buggy ass gameplay.  You can run 10 plays with identical players and get wildly different results, in blocking, in route running, in pass coverage... across the board.  Doubt we'll get any actual data to inform our decision-making, which is unfortunate.  MUTLeaks out there doing the lord's wr0k, blessing us with actual patch changes, some code snippets even, but not much beyond that.

I think your assumption is wrong keep running oop if it suits you. I feel running pop has always been a bad thing to do. I rarely encounter it online and if I did it wasn’t enough of an impact to make me notice. Like I said they lower the over all for a reason whether you believe in it or not.

SosaChamberlain said:

my entire defense is pretty much OOP and I use tackles at guard. they play like their base stats regardless of what the overall reflects.

Agreed. Too many n00bs roaming around blindly trusting whatever the last thing they watched in social media, oof.

The fact we still have to debate how pointless the OVR rating is will forever confound me. Sure, I get there's tons of newer players and EA doesn't explain anything, but a couple/few points drop off that magic OVR rating and kids immediately start to panic. 

I wish EA had the ability to properly code any type of position based changes, but they've never demonstrated any ability to even copy / paste last year's game without reintroducing tons of bugs and glitches. I have a hard time believing EA invested Dev resources changing how OOP players work. I'll continue to run tons of out of position, same as you. Just wasting my breath trying to help educate (and continually learning the nuances of the game myself). Oh well. Thanks for chiming in.